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TOPIC: What can the Jog command be used for?

What can the Jog command be used for? 2 years ago #181859

  • hugly
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There are three Jog commands listed under Console Commands, Jog Left, Jog Right, and Jog.

What can the Jog command be used for?
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Last Edit: 2 years ago by hugly.

Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 2 years ago #181863

  • briandrys
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I've just noticed that the up arrow and down arrow on the keyboard are set for left and right jog respectively. The Lightworks keyboard has next and last audio node printed on those keys, you used to have to set the left and right jog yourself in the key assignments.
Last Edit: 2 years ago by briandrys.

Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 2 years ago #181865

  • schrauber
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My test with the keyboard:
If I click on Jog immediately after releasing the Jog Left or Jog Right buttons, then the speed persists.
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Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 2 years ago #181866

  • hugly
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briandrys wrote:
I've just noticed that the up arrow and down arrow on the keyboard are set for left and right jog respectively. The Lightworks keyboard has next and last audio node printed on those keys, you used to have to set the left and right jog yourself in the key assignments.

Don't know when/if this has changed, with settings reset to defaults using "Reset All", Up/Down-arrows are assigned to "Next/Previous Audio Node" command, Ctrl+Up/Down-arrows execute "Next/Previous Keyframe".

With "Contour Shuttle (Windows)" preferences Up/Down-arrows execute Jog-Left/Right, Ctrl+Up/Down-arrows execute "Next/Previous Keyframe" as defaults. "Next/Previous Audio Node" commands are unassigned (!) which may indicate that the programmer was in a hurry as consistency was to be tested..


Do you know what "Jog" command is good for?
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Last Edit: 2 years ago by hugly.

Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 2 years ago #181867

  • hugly
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schrauber wrote:
My test with the keyboard:
If I click on Jog immediately after releasing the Jog Left or Jog Right buttons, then the speed persists.

Jog-left/right operations integrate somehow pulse rate (of keystrokes/events) to vary speed and direction. They are practically useless with a key-delay and with constant repeat rate. In other words, they are useless on a keyboard type device, you need something that can produce a variable pulse rate without delay, a mouse wheel, a jog wheel or similar.

The person who decided to put that on topmost layer of the keyboard didn't try to work with it.
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Last Edit: 2 years ago by hugly.

Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 2 years ago #181878

  • geomcd1949
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I don’t have an opinion worth sharing about the use of jog-left and jog-right functions on a keyboard, but as regards the way the LWKS jogs work on the X-Keys Pro 68 key USB Jog/Shuttle controller, I couldn’t be happier.

The scrubbing along the timeline [if scrubbing is the proper word to use], both forward and backward using the jog wheel, allows an editor to quickly get a feel for the speeds that result from spinning the jog wheel at differing rates. Control of the timeline seems to be gained and maintained intuitively.

I weigh in here only in hopes that, if changes are to be made to the jog-left and jog-right functions as they currently exist, those changes won’t significantly alter the way they now work on a jog shuttle.
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Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 2 years ago #181885

  • hugly
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I purchased a Shuttle Pro a few days ago and its jog-wheel function is practically useless for me, even after some time of practice. It overshoots extremely and unpredictable, at least on my fingers. With the shuttle-wheel and nudge commands assigned to the jog-wheel, it's much faster to stop intentionally at a certain frame (but even there, the nudge commands on jog-wheel are much less reactive than the internal nudge-function with mouse-wheel over source viewer).

I suspect that the commands jog-left/right are optimized for the Console Mark II with its huge and heavy jog-wheel. Personally I vote for adding a second set of commands optimized for the small and light jog-wheel of the Contour Shuttle. Maybe with an eye on jog-wheel operations of current DAW's?
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Last Edit: 2 years ago by hugly.

Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 2 years ago #181890

  • briandrys
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There is some lag on the Shuttle Pro jog wheel, so it needs to be used with care. The shuttle wheel doesn't suffer as much, so the slow speeds can usually set you up where you want. The effect is not dissimilar to editing analogue media like film, 1/4 audio tape and video tape.

Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 2 years ago #181894

  • hugly
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I'm not happy with it, the simulation is not good, in my view. As mentioned, I replaced jog-left/right from the jog-wheel already with nudge/reverse nudge, which is fine for me.

I don't assume the jog-functions to be a replacement for the feeling of analogue machines with analogue controls back in times. As tool to edit, it should have some advantage over the shuttle-wheel alone, otherwise it's useless.

By the way, even the official tutorials show the difference. On the console playback stops when jog-wheel stops - the tutor can't get that managed on the shuttle.
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Last Edit: 2 years ago by hugly.

Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 2 years ago #181895

  • briandrys
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Yes, it's noticeable in the shuttle tutorial, it's been discussed a number of times in the forum. There's no lag in the Lightworks Console.

With the jog wheel a slow rock and roll technique, watching the picture action and listening to the audio, seems to work best. It's quite similar to editing 1/4" audio on a tape machine.



If you wish to count a certain number of frames the keyboard is faster.
Last Edit: 2 years ago by briandrys.

Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 2 years ago #181896

  • hugly
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Hope that someone has an answer to my initial question about the jog command.

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Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 1 year, 12 months ago #181945

  • gr00by
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Hugly, you can jog left/right at the speed you wish, then you can hit a button or key, and the playback will stay at a constant speed. I've programmed my shuttlepro's driver with a "jog lock" function which uses "Jog" action. But it's not useful, IMO/for me.
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Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 1 year, 12 months ago #181947

  • hugly
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Thanks a lot for this information

After some initial trouble with not properly working shuttle-wheel, caused by unsuitable presets for German keyboards, I'm pretty happy with device now - quite robust considering the price and with good ergonomics.

Beside the presets, the only downside I haven't been able to work around is jog-wheel operation. Even nudge commands on the jog wheel are delayed and overshoot extremely which they don't on the keyboard (or even better with Lightworks build-in mouse-wheel over source viewer to nudge, which is very responsive).

What is you experience with the Contour jog-wheel together with existing Lightworks jog commands?
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Last Edit: 1 year, 12 months ago by hugly.

Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 1 year, 12 months ago #181948

  • gr00by
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What is you experience with the Contour jog-wheel together with existing Lightworks jog commands?


On Linux *and* with my "driver" I'm very happy. No lags at all. I've mastered my soft using threads with proper timing and fixes for cases related to "released" jog/wheel position (zero value issue).

As far I know Windows handles keystrokes in a different way. In my setup, a "system properties" (i.e. keys repeat/delay times) are not applied to events sent by my "driver" via keystroke emulation (X11/XTEST protocol). So the (re)action is immediate.
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Re: What can the Jog command be used for? 1 year, 12 months ago #181994

  • David Rasberry
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Jog left and jog right are keystroke commands. The Shuttlepro jog wheel is an encoder that repeats a programmed keystroke with each click.
Can't comment on Linux, but in Windows 10 with the current Contour driver, the jog left command has a 3 click delay before the first frame move and a 2 click delay for jog right. After the the first frame move, it is frame accurate with no lag unless you overrun your keystroke repeat rate. It is most effective for slow , as in 1/4 speed or less down to frame by frame movement with audio scrub for precise trimming to sound, either for sync or for a sound cue edit. I think these are the commands that are applied to the jog wheel in the Editshare driver, the lag being an unavoidable delay in driver detection of jog wheel rotation direction. But it is consistent.
Jog as far as I know only applies to the Lightworks console jog wheel which is not a keystroke repeat device.
I have applied these same commands to up and down arrow keys on my keyboard and the response is identical to the Shuttlepro jog wheel, same to or three stroke delay for first frame move.
I haven't checked to verify with 14.5, but under V12.5, a single click left with the jog wheel would initiate a very slow sub frame audio crawl on a sound track trim that would continue until you jogged one click to the right or hit stop. At which point it would align the audio track to the nearest frame head. If I recall there were 4 tics per frame in the audio track.
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Last Edit: 1 year, 12 months ago by David Rasberry.
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